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Palindromedary ~ Of course not. You have to realize that many of these modern day believers were born into this belief set. It is shared by their parents, their siblings, and their community. The Church is the central unifying force of their neighborhood. It would be easier to suck water out of concrete than it would be to cast doubt on any of these fundamental beliefs. Which is why to communicate with such people you need to at least understand and respect their beliefs. Without that minimum concession, you will be cast out as a pagan on your ear faster than you can say Holy Bat Crap Batman.
Throughout the ages there have been esoteric orders of people who believed themselves higher up on the totem pole of knowledge. They pretended to believe just like the masses believed but they manipulated subrosa, behind the scenes, to keep the masses controlled the way they wanted.
They believed that it was necessary to keep the masses believing in those things that they were prone to believing in...magic...sorcery...images of both good and evil. The masses were mostly uneducated bumpkins who could only be controlled through manipulating those iconic images. So when the myth of Jesus was created, it had to compete with the magic of other competing beliefs...not to be undone.
So the new myth of Jesus, which was billeted to fit the long awaited prophecy of a Savior that will save the Jews from the Romans, had to take on magical, mythical proportions in order to sway people away from their other beliefs.
Today, it takes things like false flag operations of terror like 9/11 to control people..in addition to the xenophobic, misdirected, self-righteous, exclusionary beliefs that such religions tend to foster.
My point is the "system," as is, will self-destruct to the detriment of all including the wealthy. If the "evil-doers" were to all disappear today, new evil-doers would appear tomorrow to fill in the vacant slots. It's the system that provides an ability to be so detrimental. Reform the system! Changing the actors will do nothing. Check out Richard Wolff on YouTube for ideas about what direction reform of capitalism might take.
Aliceinwonderland ~ That is a very good question. Most of Jesus teachings were basic logic coupled with the "right thing to do." I too get lost in the miracles. I suppose his teachings were more than enough for people like you and I; yet, for some, they weren't enough. Some people just aren't capable of "doing the right thing" without the imaginary big supernatural stick of God hanging over their heads. Especially in antiquity. Therefore, the authority of the day had to tack on all those silly myths like the ones PD mentioned. It is what it is. Whether or not they did any good is anyone's guess. What I hold true are the teachings. In the end, that is the only really important message from the story.
Sorry, I'm done editing now. I know that editing tends to shift the order of things.
Aliceinwonderland: I agree that most of the personification of Jesus is very much desired and has very positive attributes. But a myth is still a myth. And the fact is that much of the myths of Jesus and God are really the plagiarization of more ancient myths modified to suit the believability of people 2000 years ago. The early Christian cult had sought to sway Jews and Pagans alike so they needed to adopt beliefs from both in order to win converts.
The inventors of Jesus back in those days used psychological varisimilitudes of their current cultures to make their new Savior more believable, so too were they modified over that past 2000+ years for the same purpose. All the while the current day believers consider all those more ancient myths to be total BS and superstitions. It's really quite funny that they can't see this.They don't see how their current day beliefs are just as ridiculous as the more ancient myths they borrowed from. They don't really want to know where their religions and beliefs originated...they have all just been brainwashed into not questioning authority and to accept the nonsense that they have been taught to be true.
And on RT channel I see yet another Jesus-like creature, dressed in white robes, with long hair and a beard...looking very Jesus-like...that people go to for adoration and advice...he can only speak Russian though...but then again the mythical Jesus could only speak Aramaic..or so I'm told. Some people even believe that Jesus was black...and that Mary was Ethiopian. Ah, well, people will believe what they want. I sure do!
History is full of charlatans dressed in white robes...trying to emulate that myth of Jesus...and they do manage to pull in sucker believers. Some even modify their auras a bit with science fiction abandon...Raelians...Scientology...a whole bunch of weird cults pop up all the time that hope to be as powerful as the more ancient cults they try to leech from. Because they know that "suckers are born every minute".
As I said before, the characteristics of the myth of Jesus are admirable but believers tend to rely on so-called experts of Jesus, the priests, preachers, cult inventors, to manipulate that image to serve their own self interests. Very dangerous.
AMEN.
SCOTUS's opinion is simply their opinion. They are not "God". The question of when consciousness begins is, and will always be, a mystery. No one's theory or opinion carries more weight, in my own mind, than anyone else's. Those dirtbags probably don't even know what SCOTUS's position was. I'll admit, I didn't either. But it is of no consequence to me, for reasons just explained. - AIW
Since you're talking about the Flying Spaghetti Monster don't forget to mention L. Ron Hubbard and the Church of Scientology. That one takes the cake.
Hey PD- you can add "moonies" to that list.
I think that in all likelihood, Jesus was a pretty cool guy. I can get behind many of the things he is quoted for saying without compromising myself one iota. That said, I don't get why that wasn't good enough for some people; why they had to tack on all these silly myths like the ones you've mentioned. - Aliceinwonderland
chuckle8: I seriously doubt the NSA would ever hire me...they'd certainly "use" me as they "use" a lot of people...use and abuse. The thing is never to be taken in by these tricksters...and always suspect that the person you are communicating with could be either "one of them" or that "they" are certainly spying on what you are saying. Funny that the many whistle blowers, like Snowden and Asange and Manning, prove that we the people are not the ones that have mental disorders...it's the powerful and dangerous fascist pigs that have the problem. The world is being run and controlled by insane greedy people behind the curtain.
TNO-Trust No One...because the minute you do..they'll get you. Sounds paranoid, I know...but we live in paranoid-inducing times. Paranoid people running paranoid institutions that think people like me are paranoid to think that they are paranoid.
And it's not just the NSA..the other 3 letter government organizations and their well paid private MICkey Mouse companies will trick people into being their patsies..all for the propaganda effect in order to justify their existence.
Points well taken, "chuck". But when you deny people things like food, shelter and medical care, they die. It doesn't matter to me whether this is the means to an end, or an end in itself, because the results are the same. Those guys are just plain evil, regardless of what motivates them. - AIW
Politicians respond to the same reinforcers as do we all. They receive largess now which the system did not earlier allow. The system has been corrupted through a combination of self-reinforcing feedback mechanisms between the incredibly wealthy and our political functionaries. I think a case can be made that we are now governed with a positive feedback loop the result of which (characteristic of positive feedback) will be a destruction of our entire political and economic structure. If you question the above, explain how a system which gives all newly created wealth to the wealthy can actually endure. Briefly stated, trickle down doesn't!
And the Flying Spaghetti Monster goes down my throat very easily too!...ummmmm...pasta! ;-}
Ancient cultures also had their favorite myths that they found easy to go down their throats too that's why more modern myths plagiarized them....of course, they modified them so that they would be more believable by the masses. ie: born of a virgin in a manger (or cave), 3 wise men, feeding the masses, walking on water, healing the sick, bringing dead people back to life, dying on a cross and arising in 3 days prophesied to one day return to the earth, end of the world, afterlife, etc. Yeah, all very believable, huh? ;-}
And that's why so many people are hoodwinked out of their money, and often, their lives and the lives of their family by believing in all these fallacies pushed on us by preachers, priests, witch doctors and shamans. Hocus Pocus! Did I mention Rajneesh, Jim Jones and the Maharishi to name just a few?
If the People lose Net Neutrality the Corporations and Banksters will act with impunity, confident in the fact that objections to their actions will never gain ground with the Masses – if the Masses even hear about it all.
If we lose Net Neutrality the American People are done.
Green_T -- You do know that "taking a long time to figure out" is knowledge going down your throat.
green-T -- Do you know how much easier Jesus goes down my throat than knowledge.
AIW -- Most of my previous reply had very little to do with abortion. I was interested in why the dirtbags thought their views superseded those of SCOTUS. Of course, I agree with Thom and Jefferson that judicial review is destroying our democracy about as much as anything.
Pal--ary -- Thanks for all the numbers. The NSA could really use you. The advantage of the method I suggested was that you do not need to read all that has gone on before.
Pal--ary -- sounds like Jonestown in India.
AIW -- It seems to me that the ugly fascists are not trying to kill us, but they think that killing us is an acceptable side-effect for them to gain power and wealth.
I agree with you on Thom's use of the word willpower. From what Thom says all the time he must agree with you also. One of the top priorities of the Repugs is to damage the Obama administration.
Thom, with all due respect, this isn't about willpower; it's about priorities. And frankly, I think it goes even further than that. Those ugly fascists are trying to kill us... or to put it more politely, "cull the herd".
Thank you TZM! For both posts.
Thanks "chuck"! I agree, the Jewish version of when life begins makes a lot more sense, altho I've more than a hunch the little buggers become conscious in late gestation, while still in the womb. I just get tired of these arrogant macho creeps telling us what to do with our bodies; especially in cases of rape. - AIW
LOL I agree and also what about that "getting to the point" part when a few words would do. LOL It took a long time to figure out what he was talking about. A riot.